I AM NOT SAYING THAT OUR CURRENT SCIENTIFIC BELIEFS ARE CORRECT. I AM SIMPLY SAYING THAT OBJECTIVE TRUTH EXISTS AND IT CAN BE DESCRIBED.

"If one perception is accepted by the majority, then that perception becomes the TRUTH."

If and ONLY if that perception is based on a subjective thing (ie: color.) Then red is whatever the hell you want it to be, because red has NO meaning outside of human consciousness. If everyone in the world believed that asparagus is delicious, then asparagus would be delicious. These are "beliefs" about personal experiences, and since they have no objective or external reality, they can be considered "truth" to a certain extent. But when you apply this reasoning to objective, outside reality, as in Sagan's dragon in the garage example, you can believe it with all your heart and you will still be dead wrong.

Getting back to the main point, this is what is wrong with religion. It claims to know the nature of objective, external reality and offers no real defence for that claim. If religion was an entirely internal affair (such as some forms of simple spirituality) I would have no problem with it. That is what I've been trying to say all along, and I can't even begin to understand how you can disagree.

• Don't even mention his name. Shame on ya - crowslayer - June 18, 2001 - 04:36 UTC
  • Are you a solipsist? - stormcrow - June 18, 2001 - 14:12 UTC
    • Play all you want. - crowslayer - June 18, 2001 - 22:56 UTC
      • Getting pissed, now? - stormcrow - June 19, 2001 - 00:53 UTC
        • Missed the point. - crowslayer - June 19, 2001 - 03:05 UTC
          • I don't think so - stormcrow - June 19, 2001 - 03:28 UTC
            • Here's why... - crowslayer - June 19, 2001 - 15:12 UTC
              • Agree and Disagree - stormcrow - June 19, 2001 - 20:47 UTC
                • I know they do, "BUT" - crowslayer - June 19, 2001 - 21:12 UTC
                  • Not good enough - stormcrow - June 20, 2001 - 02:40 UTC
                    • Right...Good Enough, sir - crowslayer - June 20, 2001 - 03:20 UTC
                      • Okay - stormcrow - June 20, 2001 - 14:03 UTC
                        • Omit your last word ;-) - crowslayer - June 21, 2001 - 03:59 UTC
                          • So why do you believe then? - stormcrow - June 21, 2001 - 13:47 UTC
                            • Hey Guys! - doctordick - June 21, 2001 - 15:42 UTC
                              • Okily Dokily - stormcrow - June 21, 2001 - 18:13 UTC
                                • Also - stormcrow - June 21, 2001 - 18:22 UTC