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 Be the first pioneers to continue the Astronomy Discussions at our new Astronomy meeting place...The Space and Astronomy Agora SPEED, TIME VS ENERGY. Forum List | Follow Ups | Post Message | Back to Thread TopicsPosted by Abhijit Brijlal Patil on January 13, 2002 17:56:49 UTC

SPEED, TIME VS ENERGY
Mr. Abhijit Patil, C/o LIC of India, Shahada city, Dist: Nandurbar, Maharastra State, India. Pin: 425409. E-Mail Address: xabhix@hotmail.com

Abstract:

This Article aims to prove that end points of any continuous body must move at exactly same moment whatever may be distance between those end points. If there is "time interval" for movement of end points of continuous body, then we can use this time interval to create "free" energy.

Introduction:

We are aware of example of "superluminal scissors" in which, we think, ends of blades(one light year long) of scissors can travel many times faster than speed of light. Physics explain that this does not happen in reality because any body can not have infinite rigidity. I am giving below my logical experiment which explain that information must travel between end points of continuous body at exactly same moment. It must not have speed limit. Otherwise law of conservation of energy is violated.

Logical Experiment (I):

Please Note: I am giving larger system only for the sake of better understanding. In fact, this experiment applies to any system. Fundamental concept of this experiment is that if "information" regarding event i.e. change in situation between end points of continuous body has speed limit, then we can "use" this speed limit to "create free, extra energy". I am giving speed of sound in my experiment only because physics explain that "information" travel in water with speed of sound in water. Even if we say that "information" travel with speed of light, it does not affect my experiment in any way. I request reader to concentrate on this fundamental concept while reading this Article.

Imagine a circular water reservoir of radius 1000 meter and depth 10 meter fully filled with water. Hose pipe of cross sectional radius 2 centimeter is attached to bottom of reservoir. Let length of this pipe be 3 million km and arranged in horizontal, spiral structure on ground so that water reservoir is near our left hand and open end "B" of pipe, with valve, is near our right hand touched to ground. (End "A" at left hand is attached to bottom of water reservoir and end "B" is near our right hand). The entire horizontal 3 million Km long pipe on ground is full of water.

Action I:

Let us open the valve at end "B" so that, due to pressure difference, water begins to flow out of end "B" on ground with speed 10 m/s(for example only. In fact, if pipe is not connected at end "A", according to equations speed of water will be 14 m/s. But we are considering friction of water with pipe. Hence speed of water will decrease. Reader should note that we are not going to change length of pipe in our experiment. So friction will be constant throughout experiment). According to Physics, this "information" regarding flow of water from end "B" will travel back across the full length of pipe i.e. 3 million Km with speed of sound. Speed of sound in water is 1482 m/s. So it will take about 2,024,291 seconds i.e. 23 days 10 hours 18 minutes and 11 seconds to reach this "information" to water level in reservoir and only after that water level in reservoir will come down. After such a long time, there will be steady, uniform flow of water in pipe.

Action II:

Now there is steady flow of water in pipe. According to equation of continuity, as cross sectional area of pipe throughout 3 million Km is uniform, speed and volume of water entering the pipe from reservoir at end "A" is exactly equal to speed and volume of water leaving the pipe at end "B". Let us lift the last 100 meter segment of hose pipe at end "B" straight up in vertical direction pointing towards sky. Remember, we are lifting only last 100 meter segment of pipe. NOT ENTIRE PIPE. Now height of water column in reservoir is 10 meter and at end "B", in vertical hose pipe is 100 meter.

Obviously, water pressure in 100 meter vertical pipe is greater than that in reservoir. So to maintain equilibrium, water should flow from end "B" to end "A" i.e. reservoir. But problem is that how the water in reservoir will come to "know" that we have changed situation at end "B" and water pressure at end "B" is greater so that it should stop flow of water towards end "B" and allow water from vertical pipe i.e. end "B" to flow towards reservoir to maintain equilibrium. Because established knowledge of physics says that this "information" regarding change in pressure at end "B" will travel back towards reservoir with speed equal to speed of sound in water. So it will take 23 days, 10 hours, 18 minutes and 11 seconds for this "information" to reach to water reservoir. As water in reservoir has no "information" what we have done at end "B"during this time, it will continue to flow as if nothing is happened!. According to equation of continuity, same volume of water which left reservoir will continue to flow through hose pipe at end "B" 90 meter above level of water in reservoir! And it will continue to flow for 23 days, 10 hours, 18 minutes and 11 seconds!

Please note, during these 23 days and 10 hours, end "B" is at 90 meter higher level than water level in reservoir. But still, due to extremely slow speed of "information transfer" regarding change in situation i.e. water pressure at end "B", Water in reservoir simply don't "know" that water pressure at end "B" is changed and water flow is directed in vertical direction! Hence water will continue to flow at height 90 meter above the water level in reservoir without any energy! This defies gravity. And we can calculate the tremendous amount of water which will flow at higher level during these 23 days, 10 hours, 18 minutes and 11 seconds(25425.09 cubic meter, in our experiment. We can increase it by increasing length and cross sectional area of hose pipe). Yes, we have spent energy in lifting pipe. But we can calculate it. It will be negligible compared to what we are getting in return.

My question is "Can It Really Happen?"
We know, only one answer: YES or NO.

(1) If YES, then in this way, we can lift water from oceans to higher level in dams without spending any energy at all. And we can use it in hydroelectric power plants to generate power. Better to shut down all the thermal and nuclear power plants on earth We don't need them. Because we will have never ending source of "free energy". This is completely against law of conservation of energy and totally illogical, inconceivable.

(2) If NO, then it means flow of water stopped at exactly same moment when we lifted hose pipe above level of water in reservoir. In another word information regarding change in situation at end "B" reached to water level in reservoir at exactly same moment!. At least 10 times faster than speed of light.

Discussion:

If we say that YES! The water will continue to flow 90 meter above level of water in reservoir! That is because just before we changed situation at end "B", the water in horizontal pipe all over 3 million km length of pipe has gained momentum. And this momentum will supply energy to water to enable it to flow 90 meter above the water level in reservoir for 23 days, 10 hours, 18 minutes and 11 seconds! We may think that no law is violated. But we ignores completely that at the end of 23 days and 10 hours, we have tremendous amount of water at height 100 meter which was initially at 10 meter only and we have spent negligible energy.

The gravitational potential energy associated with particle-earth system depends only on vertical position or height of the particle. Equation of potential energy is PE = mgh. So reader should note that when the water was in reservoir, its PE was 10mg and after 23 days 10 hours, its PE will be 100mg. Hence it has gained 90mg PE. And we have spent negligible energy to lift the pipe at end "B" in few seconds. I request reader to concentrate on this argument. Where from that "extra" 90mg came? We can use this "extra" PE to create "extra" power in hydroelectric power plants. And please note that, I have given 100 meter height for example. We can increase the height to extent we want. And we can "create" tremendous potential energy. So all the power companies are invited to this "free lunch"!

In reality, momentum of water can never be so large to enable it to flow above water level in reservoir. In daily life, we have seen that when the opening end of pipe is at the bottom or below the bottom of reservoir in our homes, water comes out with tremendous speed(depending upon volume and height of water column in reservoir). So we think that with such speed it can easily flow "above" water level in reservoir. But NO. It does not happen. Reader should also concentrate on example of Roller Coster. In roller coaster, we come down towards earth with enormous speed due to gravity(depending upon height). But that speed can never throw us "above" the point from where we begin to come down. Most simple example is of pendulum. Potential energy of any body must be exactly equal to kinetic energy and at any point of time PE + KE must be constant.

We are concentrating on speed of sound in water only because physics tells us that information transfer takes place in water with this speed. In fact even if we assume that information transfer in water takes place with speed of light, it does not affect our experiment in any way. Only thing we will have to do is to increase length of pipe for better understanding. For better understanding, we can use rigid pipe of 1 meter diameter of 3 million Km(or more) and at end "B", we can attach our 100 meter vertical hose pipe of 2 centimeter radius. Equation of continuity will do its work. Reader might argue that water will not flow at all in such long pipe, but he should concentrate that in other words he is saying that water in pipe will turn in moleculear structure like that of metal. And reader will have to explain, how can this happen. Water flows because of pressure difference and shearing stress. How can water in pipe at end"B", when it is on ground, sustain shearing stress and molecules of water just stick with each other and pipe?

TEST PRACTICLE EXPERIMENT:

It is no denying fact that it is almost impossible for us to arrange such 3 million Km long pipe to verify the truthness of this experiment. But certainly we can do test experiment with just 15 Km long pipe. In fact, I think, in any city, underground water supply network is longer than 15 Km. If "information" regarding change in water pressure really travels with speed of sound in water, then it will take at least 10.12 seconds to reach state of equilibrium. We can lift other end "B" to just few centimeter above water level in reservoir. During these 10.12 seconds water will continue to flow "above" water level in reservoir(according to physics). If this happens, then certainly it is against law of conservation of energy and gravity.

If such experiment is already done somewhere, I request reader to inform me on my e-mail address. If such experiment is not done at any time in history, then I wonder, how can we assume that information transfer in water take place with speed of sound. Has ever scientists "seen" with their own eyes that in test experiment like I have given(15 Km long pipe), water flows out of end "B" at heigher level or not? If scientists believe that "information" travel with speed of sound in water i.e. 1482 m/s, then we can use only 15 Km long pipe to see it with "our own eyes". Has ever scientists performed such experiment? I agree, neither I have performed such experiment. But doesn't it lead to raise suspicion about current knowledge of physics regarding information transfer if no one on planet earth has experimentally verified it? And we know, certainly we will not need million dollar budget to buy 15 km long pipe and perform such test experiment.

Logical Experiment (II):

Imagine line of pullies all over 3 million Km distance. Let us pass a 3 million Km long cable over these pullies. End "A" of this cable is at our end and End "B" is at far end.Action I:Lets us pull end "A" at 09.15.00 GMT in downward direction by 1 meter. Let time taken to complete action be 1 second(09.15.01 GMT). Physics says that this information regarding force applied will travel across cable with speed of light and only after 10 seconds, at 09.15.10 GMT, end "B" of cable will be pulled in upward direction and at 09.15.11, will be up by 1 meter. Let energy spent in pulling the cable be X joule.

Action II:

Let us freshly repeat this action on second day at 09.15.00 GMT. Now the person at far end "B" decides to do trick and attaches mass of say 1 kg to cable at exactly 09.15.00 GMT. Now as this information is not reached to our end "A", we apply same force we applied on first day and complete our action by 09.15.01 GMT. End "A" is down by 1 meter. Energy spent is same as on first day i.e. X Joule. Now this information regarding force applied will reach to end "B" after 10 seconds. I leave it on reader to decide what will be action on 1 Kg mass which is attached to end "B".

My question is "Will this mass of 1 Kg will be pulled in upward direction?"
Only one answer, YES or NO.

(1) IF YES, then we have done extra work without spending any energy at all. We can use this speed limit of force applied to lift any mass without spending any energy at all.

(2) IF NO, then it means that the mass of 1 Kg will not move at all. But we have pulled cable at end "A" by one meter. If the mass attached does not move at all, then it means that length of wire is increased by one meter i.e. cable is elongated. Just 1 kg mass is enough to stretch strong, rigid cable by 1 meter. Thus we can stretch any cable, however rigid it is, by attaching just 1 kg(or even 1 gram) mass by doing such experiment.

I request reader to perform same experiment with 3 million Km long rod in SPACE and repeat Action I and II.

Conclusion:

We should come to the conclusion that when we lift pipe the flow of water must stop at exactly same moment it reaches level of water in reservoir. Whatever may be length of pipe, it does not matter. Even if single drop of water flow above water level in reservoir without energy, law of conservation of energy collapse. In second logical experiment also, information regarding force applied must reach to other end of cable at exactly same moment. If there is really speed limit for information transfer in these specific experiments, we can "use" it in this way to gain "free energy". But this does not happen. So information regarding occurrence of event between end points of continuous body must travel at exactly same moment.

I am NOT arguing about speed of "sound" in water neither I am arguing about speed of "light" in space. In Anology, it is like information transfer between two planets. We can communicate with person on Moon (or any planet) through EM waves i.e. speed of light. I am not arguing about this mode of communication between two planets. I am arguing about information transfer, attraction through "Gravity" between two planets. I intend to prove that in these experiments, information transfer takes place at exactly same moment irrespective of distance between end points through another property of matter i.e. "Gravity". What exactly nature of "Gravity" is, it is beyond scope of this Article.

Thanks.