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Yes, I Think It's Marvelous.

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Posted by Paul R. Martin on April 24, 2001 18:15:18 UTC

Hi Phil,

You asked, "So what do you think overall about our ability to develop ourselves free of outside influence?"

I think it is just like some advice I heard a long time ago. If you don't want to be just like your parents, in some respect or other, all you have to do is be aware of those things you don't want to emulate. If you are unaware of those things, then no matter if they are desireable or undesireable, you are bound to be just like them.

So, yes, I do think we have the ability to develop ourselves free of outside influence...if..., and it is a big 'if', we first become aware of the outside influence. With this understanding, we then have the option of going along with them, or striking out on our own.

I think it is unfortunate that the scientific community is under such strong influence by the system that provides the funding, and hence the life support for the scientists. I think this inhibits free thought in many scientists.

The other extreme is a guy like me. I have utter freedom to think anything I like, but on the other hand, I am not a functioning part of any mechanism that can get anything done. I think the big breakthroughs are when there is some leakage between these two poles.

I don't understand your question: "Is there a thing anymore?", so I won't comment on it.

"As far as "merging" That could go both ways, it depends on the cirumstances,what are the circumstances in the world we live in today?"

As I see it the 'merging' definitely goes both ways. At the smallest scale, I think there is communication between human consciousness and god's consciousness. Or, if you like, between me and TOM. I think this communication is very limited for many reasons. Mostly because of the vast gulf in scope and context between the two.

I also think there is a 'merger' going on at the very largest of scales. I haven't mentioned this at all in any of these forums, but you got me going.

I think that god has created many universes, only some of which are the consequences of the mathematics of numbers, like ours. After one of these universes has achieved a sufficient level of complexity, such as ours recently has, where god can build remote-controlled organisms through which he can vicariously experience a sunset -- and yes, a war, god's knowledge has increased by the amount of those experiences.

There is a transfer both ways. God in turn, somehow communicates back down to the organisms (us) some information that helps us become aware of and understand the universe more and more to allow us to control parts of it.

I think that in the biggest picture from the perspective of a universe like ours, the transfer of knowledge becomes more or less complete to the benefit of the universe and to the detriment of god. This culmination, which might be thought of as Teilhard's Omega Point, is when the universe itself is aware of its entire history and understands how to do it a little better, or at least a little differently, next time.

So the net effect is that 'reality' has grown, in the sense that it now 'knows' some of the methods and consequences of certain kinds of creation. This provides the starting point for the next round of creation.

There has been a lot of time for this scenario to play out, and you can see that already, there are a fairly large number of bits of information in reality so far. But, it is still only a finite number, and always will be. It just keeps growing though.

If you have read this far, there is a chance that you might be interested in reading some of my idle speculations along these lines that have been put into essay form. You can find them at .

You said, "We are at a crisis point, superfree thought is a critical necessity at this point of our development. We are no longer simply sponges!"

I totaly agree. I think there are going to be some very different things happening here on Earth in this century.

Warm regards,


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