Tenacious: Alright, who am I kidding? The religion that I attempt to discredit is Christianity, because that's my background (you obviously already realized that). I don't base disbelief in God because Christianity is flawed; I pose this argument as a reason to disbelieve Christainity. It's not the only reason, or even the main reason I can't believe in God.

Greg: Alright. Now as I've said, I'm not Christian. But... I believe there is a difference between Christianity and the Teachings of Jesus Christ. Jesus Taught Love of Life, Love of Creation, Love of Thy Neighbor, and Love for the Heavenly Father(which I approve of as one and the same with Love of Creation, being a Taoist). Now if all men approved of these Teachings, the world would be a virtual utopia. Though Christianity may be flawed, the premise on which it is based is not.

Tenacious: I've already said before that I acknowledge many various definitions for God. I don't completely rule out the possibility of God, but I believe that the evidence for his existence is lacking (in my eyes).

Greg(before): "What you are saying here is that "if I were God, I'd do it this way." God created the universe so that it would evolve based upon the Laws of Physics Created in the First Second of the Big-Bang. It has worked just fine the way He Created it, over fifteen billion years ago. He is Omnipotent, He could change it, but why should He, He Created it the way it is. If He altered things for the benefit of just the few, the many would suffer, by not having the opportunity to appreciate learning to provide for themselves. Everyone would just sit back and let God take care of it all. Is that the life you want?"

Tenacious: I believe that when it comes to needless suffering, divine intervention could have (and should have) occured to save the day. I'm saying that if God was all loving, he would intervene to stop suffering that WASN'T necessary. I say this because suffering is not entirely negative. Experiencing suffering can make one stronger, and help to gain a higher appreciation in life. Hence, I acknowledge that some suffering can be "soul building." However, suffering doesn't always do this; often it can destroy people and leave them as mere shells. For example, if God even had the slightest clue that Hitler would have committed one the worst atrocities in human history, he could have intervened without interfering with our free will. If he'd prevented that particular sperm from fertilizing the egg at conception (neither the sperm or the egg had free will), Hitler would have never existed. Few will admit the world wouldn't have been a better place without the holocost. And might I point out, the holocost had adverse effects for many (much of the world was dragged into war), not just the few. Indeed, I think a loving God would not allow his children to undergo needless suffering, if it were in his power to do so.

Greg: The suffering of others, gives the rest an opportunity to Learn Compassion, and how to think of others before one's self, how to reach out to attempt to eliminate their suffering. How might we Learn to care for one another if no one suffered? It might help if you understood one thing about God. He has Moral Integrity, but He IS Amoral. :o)

Tenacious: As far as sitting back and letting God take care of it all; I'll admit that it's not an attractive option to me. But in that case, what's heaven then? I'm not saying that you necessarily believe in heaven (since you do have a unique image of God), but surely you believe in some form of afterlife. Is heaven simply a place of paradise where you sit back and God provides all?

Greg: I am grateful for This Gift of Life, I aspire to appreciate no other. I am content to push up daisies, or feed the fishes, come this life's end. My Heart's concern is simply to provide for the species, because I believe God has provided the potential where we might evolve Consciousness equal even unto Himself, even though we might have to join with all the other Self-Aware Consciousness in the Universe in group consciousness in order to accomplish it. :o)

: I... brain... me tireeed... need... sleep... : bye.

Sleep Tight, My Friend.